June 9, 2015 at 7:32 pm #11428paulwalkerParticipant
The sad thing is this is nothing new, just a wolf in sheep’s clothing. I hope most can remember Jim and Tammy Faye Bakker.
Tammy Faye is of course now deceased, but not before leaving us with a fascinating documentary, “The Eyes Of Tammy Faye”, about her life both with and without Jim. Jim is still out there conjuring up whatever.June 9, 2015 at 7:50 pm #11434
>>Making this kind of money in a ministry under the auspice of a 501(c)3 is a farce.
I think many would be surprised about the wages of your local mega church pastor to which there are many 1000+ churches in Portland….again all with boards/accountability…sayin…June 9, 2015 at 8:32 pm #11435AmusParticipant
I think many would be surprised about the wages of your local mega church pastor…
Enlighten us please.
askin…June 9, 2015 at 9:09 pm #11436
Would it be to many here such a travesty that a Lead Pastor of a church that has thousands of congregants in Portland make an annual wage near 6 figures?June 9, 2015 at 10:01 pm #11437Chris_TaylorParticipant
I used to attend a 1000 member Presbyterian church. Weekly attendance was around 600 over three services. The Head of Staff, at the time of my departure, was making around 100k with benefits making his total package about 140k.
Pretty nice. Is he worth it? Probably depends on who you ask. The associate pastor and family ministry pastors were being paid 65-85K, approx. Then comes administrative and custodial staff.
The annual budget was around 1.3 million per year all via donations.
By the governing laws within the Presbyterian church, you must report annually to your congregation all things related financially. There also is time for discussion and answering questions during this congregational meeting. Then by verbal vote, the budget is voted on. Always passing in the years I attended.
Within the Presbyterian tradition they have a Session. The governing body of the church. Persons are selected for Session from the widest of demographics and serve 2 year terms. After which they can renew up or choose to leave. The head pastor moderates Session, but can’t vote on anything. The pastor can offer their input, but Session can decide whether to use it or not. It’s not supposed to be a dictatorship.
The problem I see with Dollar’s operation – is the slap in the face of the very God he says he serves. Scripture is filled with stories of those who use God for money and power. One of the biggest no-no’s.June 9, 2015 at 10:30 pm #11439paulwalkerParticipant
Oh, and I hesitate to mention many drive-time personalities in Portland are lucky to make 40K. (negating the star performers…not sure who are left except for a couple on Iheart, and worth every dollar.)June 9, 2015 at 11:02 pm #11442skepticalParticipant
Pokémon is the origin of many teens homosexuality according to Pastor Creflo DollarJune 10, 2015 at 5:48 pm #11468AmusParticipant
Pokemons name, in all languages, aims to guide young people towards the choice of homosexuality
I don’t get it.
Would that name be “poke-a-man”?June 10, 2015 at 7:43 pm #11471VitalogyParticipant
The salary of a pastor should be $0.00 per year.
If you’re not willing to volunteer your time, you are by definition a Charlatan.
What other industry is allowed such a benefit?
It’s this type of crap that’s proof that any tax benefit involved with religion should end. No more tax breaks for any religion no matter what. Pay your way or shut it down.
Given the US doesn’t officially sponser a said religion, it shouldn’t be an issue, right?June 10, 2015 at 8:03 pm #11473
>>The salary of a pastor should be $0.00 per year.
1 Timothy 5:18b “Those who work deserve their pay!”June 10, 2015 at 9:04 pm #11477NoPartyParticipant
Deserve their pay but not at an asinine level like this joker.June 10, 2015 at 10:23 pm #11481Chris_TaylorParticipant
We are in a different age and time.
I lean into taxing churches. They are becoming more politically active, some subtle, others not. It’s a layer of accountability that I believe needs to happen.
I also believe in taxing businesses and corporations who make hideous amounts of money as well.June 11, 2015 at 1:45 am #11485skepticalParticipant
Churches, lets say Wilsonville, for instance, are of moderate building sizes (10k sq foot so) but have 10 to 20 acres — this excess land is off the tax base and could be put to use to generate taxes for the city if developed. I’d suggest 10K ft Church building and 1 acre tax-free, but beyond that, Churches would have to pay taxes what the city would get if fully developed retail.
Secondly, if you’re going to pay Pastors big bucks, you pretty much have to do away with volunteers to do work fundamental to the operation of the Church — either everybody gets paid or nobody. Real businesses can’t get away with “interns” doing fundamental work, and neither should Churches if they rake in bucks beyond reasonable operation of a Church.
With the growth of megachuches and fleets of jet aircrafts, society needs rein in the free rides (or flights).June 11, 2015 at 11:57 am #11502missing_kskdParticipant
When clergy are getting private jets and living lavishly, there is enough money and real business going on to warrant taxes.
The idea of no taxes was associated with humble people providing much needed spiritual guidance and fellowship as a service to society. And that idea remains valid too. I’ve no objection.
Here, we’ve got a business running tax free, and it’s still operating under the expectations of a much more modest effort. Faith can get big, or remain small, whatever. But when the money gets big there is no way in hell things remain all about the faith and serving the society, it’s people and their need for spiritual things.
It’s about the money, just like any business is about the money, and that means taxes.
God doesn’t need all that cash, and we don’t need people claiming to speak for God for cash either. It’s just not genuine.
Regarding the pay of Pastors.
Most smaller organizations own grounds, or will provide for a modest life, home, car, utilities, and so forth in return for a Pastor serving everybody spiritually.
This is a good, healthy thing. I fully support it, and have known some pastors who are doing it right, adding value to the lives of people and so forth.
When that lifestyle begins to get shiny, we really do need to ask some questions, hard questions, because it’s very likely turned away from the religious service and toward a career, money, and all that goes with secular capitalistic ideas.June 11, 2015 at 2:03 pm #11504VitalogyParticipant
Tax them like everyone else.
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