December 6, 2019 at 1:49 pm #43442
I’m not sure why anyone had an expectation at the outset that Trump would be removed in the Senate after being impeached – or that the Democrats would have failed otherwise. It has always seemed like a “hail mary” to hope for Republicans to suddenly care more about the Constitution than partisan politics. It’s always seemed that conviction was “going nowhere.” The fact that it still isn’t is not really news.
As I said above, the Democrats really had no choice but to impeach over this. Impeachment without conviction may not be great for Democrats, but NOT impeaching him at all would have been worse in my opinion.December 6, 2019 at 2:07 pm #43443VitalogyParticipant
Plus, let’s get the GOP Senators on record for defending this POS president who has obviously committed acts worthy of impeachment. History will not be kind and legacies will be sullied.December 6, 2019 at 2:54 pm #43444
Yes, I agree – get them on the record in time for the 2020 election.December 6, 2019 at 5:10 pm #43445
You guys are of course correct on the principle of the thing. Impeachment by the House was practically mandatory. At least someone is being guided by the Constitution.
The frustration is that Trump will still be there, albeit with an asterisk. And he may stay for another 4 years.December 6, 2019 at 6:31 pm #43446
Yep, he may be there another four years.
I insist on living in reality, though. I may not like the fact that the Democrats may nominate someone who will lose to Trump next fall…but that’s the way it is. Nothing I can do about it. Personally, I blame the Democratic base if we don’t win next fall.
It’s a shame some of the earlier candidates didn’t get enough traction to stay in the Democratic primary race; Steve Bullock just dropped out, and even though I didn’t really like him very much, I really liked his views on a lot of things. I think he might have won states like Iowa and the rust belt states that other candidates will have trouble with. But he just wasn’t liberal enough; too many Democratic voters have fallen for the promises of Sanders and Warren that they can have free-everything and get rid of billionaires and that the rest of the country will vote for that candidate for president too. I don’t buy it.
I wish Democrats would focus on winning back semi-permanent majorities in Congress instead of on electing the perfect liberal candidate for president. I say, elect someone not that liberal who can win the midwest again but will sign bills from Congress improving health care and nominate pro-choice judges and justices to the courts – and let Congress push the legislative agenda.December 7, 2019 at 12:35 am #43447semoochieParticipant
I have no problem with billionaires. I just don’t like them being turned into trillionaires at the expense of everyone else!December 7, 2019 at 10:15 am #43449
I’m not expecting conviction in the Senate. But I am hoping (wishing?) for some cracks in the Trump Syncophant wall. Maybe a half-dozen Republicans flip, at most?December 7, 2019 at 10:49 am #43450
It may be a small victory if four Republican senators vote to remove (assuming all the Democrats do) and we can say “a majority of the Senate voted to remove Trump,” something Clinton avoided in 1999 when only 50 Senators voted to convict him in his impeachment trial. Trump is probably very attuned to things like that.December 7, 2019 at 12:18 pm #43451
Getting the Senate conviction vote to 51 or more would be glorious, akin to Trump’s sore spot of winning the presidency despite losing the popular vote. He’ll have a hard time campaigning against that.December 7, 2019 at 2:21 pm #43452
I suspect there is a lot of behind-the-scenes arm twisting already happening among certain Senate Republicans to try to avoid the 51+ vote for the reason you mention. How would Trump ever live down being compared unfavorably to Bill Clinton in HIS impeachment trial vote?
Trump will finally at least be able to claim an achievement Obama couldn’t pull off: Trump managed to get himself impeached.December 7, 2019 at 2:39 pm #43453
I would think that some purple state Senate Republicans are going to have some serious soul (and poll) searching to do in a month or so. Is it wiser be the first rat to jump from a sinking ship, or the last?December 7, 2019 at 3:47 pm #43454
I’ll bet you as long as no more than three Republicans vote to convict and the total stays at 50 or below, Trump will be OK. And Senate Republicans are not going to hold it against their fellow Republicans in tough re-election rates to vote YES to try to hold on to their seat in 2020 (e.g. Susan Collins, Corey Gardner). They want to keep those seats more than they want to force a unanimous NO vote from all Republicans.
Romney is a wildcard – he may wind up voting NO despite all of his earlier high-handed lecturing of Trump after sucking up to him first to try to become Secretary of State and then for his endorsement in the Utah Senate race. Sure looks like he’ll vote YES, but it wouldn’t surprise me in the least if he votes NO anyway. Maybe he’ll say “this is awful and disgraceful conduct by the President…but heck, let’s not impeach him over it!”December 7, 2019 at 5:20 pm #43455
If Romney votes no, he may keep his Senate seat but not his self-respect.
Used to think the same thing about Lindsey, but he put his soul up for permanent bid to the highest bidder a long time ago.December 18, 2019 at 4:54 pm #43504
Everyone is so dug in to their positions it’s demoralizing. Posturing for the record and future re-election.
It really is SO SAD, as Dear Dotard might say.December 19, 2019 at 2:54 pm #43514
What happens if Pelosi chooses not to send the articles of impeachment to the Senate? I kind of like that scenario.
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