The fallacy of Conservative Christianity

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Viewing 13 posts - 316 through 328 (of 328 total)
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  • #5089
    Amus
    Participant

    “I don’t know anything about those particular programs, but if they helped people, that’s great”

    “I don’t know?!?”

    Honestly, I’m kind of speechless.

    I’m going to assume from the “1949” suffix to your most recent user ID that you are 65 (ish).
    (I’m 58 FWIW)

    This is one of the defining pieces of legislation of our lifetime, and reviled by any Conservative worth his salt.

    How someone of our generation could be oblivious to it is beyond me, and frankly speaks volumes of your knowledge base.

    #5090
    jerry1949
    Spectator

    Sorry, I just have little interest in studying the specifics of government programs. I’m more interested in discussing the concepts behind them and behind opposing them, though I’d much rather discuss religion.

    I’m 59.

    #5091
    jerry1949
    Spectator

    Here’s an explaination, Dux:

    http://www.catholic.com/magazine/articles/what-no-salvation-outside-the-church-means

    It’s interesting that you are citing a “born again” source. Have you been “born again”? Are you in agreement with the author’s religion or only with his anti-Catholicism?

    #5092
    duxrule
    Participant

    I’m in agreement with MY anti-religionism. Thanks, but no thanks for another one of the Catholicism 95 lessons. You should know that there was a time in my life that my parents thought that I was headed for the Priesthood, and I spent a week in a special retreat at the Mt. Angel Abbey. I have a good grasp of “what Catholics believe,” and I really don’t need any of your links. You’re evading, not enlightening. Church dogmas change. History illustrates that. Dogma does not align with fact. Otherwise, Catholics wouldn’t be risking their place in Heaven by using contraception. More links to articles on the rudiments of Catholicism isn’t changing any of that.

    #5094
    Amus
    Participant

    Sorry, I just have little interest in studying the specifics of government programs.

    How can you make an informed decision if you aren’t informed?

    #5095
    jerry1949
    Spectator

    The link I posted refutes your anti-Catholic sola scriptura source by putting everything in its proper context.

    Your belief that the Church changes its dogma is why you left the Cathloic Church?

    That some would risk their eternal salvation to enjoy a temporal pleasure is not a new concept, and doesn’t prove the church is wrong about contraception. It’s called “concupiscence.”

    You’re fortunate to have been raised Catholic. I envy that. It took me until I was 38 to discover the truth of Catholicism.

    #5096
    Amus
    Participant

    You’re fortunate to have been raised Catholic. I envy that. It took me until I was 38 to discover the truth of Catholicism.

    Perhaps another way to look at it is that he has already traveled the road to disillusionment that took you 38 years to just begin?

    #5097
    Vitalogy
    Participant

    Sounds to me like mental illness started to kick in at age 38.

    Lucky for me I figured out by grade 5 that the catholic religion was weird and creepy. I got as far as a first communion and luckily never had any over nighters with the preist.

    But I specifically remember how creepy and weird it was and wondered why I was being made to go.

    #5098
    jerry1949
    Spectator

    But it’s not weird and creepy to jack off every day…

    You live in an upsidedown world.

    #5099
    duxrule
    Participant

    “Jerry,” your links illustrate completely the length to which the Catholic Church will go to protect what it claims to be its message. Church dogma has changed over the millenia. Not all of it, but some aspects. Even a cursory examination of the Church and its history shows this to be so. Church dogma does not follow scientific fact. Again, the ban on contraception shows this to be true. There is NO logical, scientific or spiritual reason to continue to continue that ban, and a large majority of American Catholics agree. My reasons for leaving the church are my own. Let’s just say that through my life experience, I have found more expansive ways to express my spiritual side. It’s good that you have found a way to express your own spirituality, but you need to be aware that the Catholic Church isn’t all that it claims to be.

    #5106
    Vitalogy
    Participant

    I think it’s weird or creepy if any male human being ISN’T jacking off every day.

    #5114
    Chris_Taylor
    Participant

    “Of course Jesus started a Church. He wouldn’t have left it all up to individuals to do their own thing so that each person can be their own pope with their own doctrine tailor-made to suit their whims and desires. To practice true Christianity is a challenge.”

    Nope. That was never Jesus’ mission. Jesus never left a blueprint on how to “do church.”

    Really, Jerry, you need to study up on ancient middle eastern culture at the time of Jesus. Jesus would never have ascribed to the kind of orthodoxy you hold too.

    However, Jerry, I think there are many reasons why you personally hold onto the orthodoxy. From what little I gather about your life, and I admit I’m speculating, but prior to the age of 38, you personally were adrift in your own spiritual life. Hey, it happens. Trying to put some concrete footing under oneself is admirable and worthy of the undertaking. But, as I have seen with others in my life, the pendulum swings wildly at times as one tries to figure out the purpose in their life and if God should be a part of it. Those are actually the moments of growth we all need to go through…even as hellish as they sometimes can be.

    But from what I see, where you now hold your conclusions, the way in which you make the Catholic church seemingly more important than Jesus or even God, that’s where you lose me.

    I come from a reformed protestant (Presbyterian) tradition. The emphasis is not on the church, but on Jesus.

    I wish you well in your faith journey.

    #5118
    duxrule
    Participant

    This schism between Catholic Church dogma and American health care practices stands to have a HUGE impact, as the Church takes a larger and larger role in the delivery of said health care.

    U.S. Bishops Take Aim at Sterilization

    A toughening of Catholic medical directives could include enforcing a ban on tubal ligations.

    “…Tubal ligations are the second most common form of birth control used by American women (just slightly behind the Pill) and by far the most popular method among women in their 30s and 40s, according to new data from the CDC. An estimated 700,000 tubal sterilizations are performed in the U.S. every year.

    In this country, approximately half the women who get their tubes tied have the procedure in outpatient settings; the rest have it in hospitals following the delivery of a baby. Because of the position of the uterus after childbirth, postpartum sterilizations are easier to perform, they don’t add any recovery time, and they are almost foolproof, Prager said.

    If a woman can’t have her tubes tied immediately after delivery, she must wait until her body has healed — generally six weeks. At that point, the hurdles to having the procedure — a newborn and family to care for, insurance and other financial issues, a lack of maternity or sick leave — often lead to women abandoning the idea. Meanwhile, other forms of birth control may not be as reliable. In one study of new mothers in Texas who were denied a tubal ligation after childbirth, nearly 50 percent had an unplanned pregnancy within 12 months. “It’s not just a convenience thing,” said Prager, who is vice chair of the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists’ Committee on Health Care for Underserved Women. Denying postpartum sterilizations “has very real consequences for entire families,” she said.

    The discontent among doctors has increased in recent years, as Catholic healthcare has seen explosive growth and partnerships between Catholic and secular providers have become both more common and more complicated. Ten of the 25 largest health systems in the nation — and four of the five largest nonprofit networks —are now Catholic-sponsored.”
    http://www.propublica.org/article/u.s.-bishops-take-aim-at-sterilization?utm_source=et&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=dailynewsletter&utm_content=&utm_name=

    This has the potential to make Hobby Lobby look like an origami crane.

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