June 15, 2018 at 1:01 pm #37500
Sorry, Missing, that isn’t how it works. You can’t wait around until the perfect candidate can organize the perfect campaign before something can finally happen. Otherwise, you may wait forever.
If Medicaid for All is truly an issue that motivates voters, candidates who run on it will start winning. If not, then you’re just wrong about it – sorry.June 15, 2018 at 1:24 pm #37501
They are winning. Got a few on the board now, more to come. It’s still pretty early, and despite that and a definite challenge in not taking big PAC money, some people are successful.
Wash, rinse, repeat.
Nobody is waiting around.
What is happening is people are:
A. Pressuring current legislators to move on the issues
B. Running for office, looking to become those legislators
C. Organizing public support, activism.
“wrong” isn’t really a term we can use right now. Most of politics is advocacy. Debate is a subset of advocacy too.
“Debate” in the form of policy visions, looks about like what we are seeing. Progressives have very strong ideas, well aligned to needs, ordinary people. And they are taking those to the people, and government.
That is precisely how it works. As intended. Have you forgotten your primary education?
With health care policy specifically, the US is the most expensive, and has in a broad sense, the worst overall outcomes, using basics like life expectancy, average citizen cost and risk exposure, etc…
Improving on that as a worthy goal isn’t very debatable. How to improve on it is, and that debate is going on right now.
Where advocacy is a super set of debate, we see the need to do more than present facts, and well argued opinions. That’s been the progressive mode for a long time, and it was under the assumption there actually was meaningful debate on economic policy, including health care.
The influence of money is getting very seriously in the way of that making sense, and or being effective at all. The ACA legislation highlighted this, and is the genesis of much of what is going on right now.
There is a clear need to become government, compete with the big money politics. That is what is new.
It is entirely obvious the big money won’t actually fund change or progress on an issue, and you can pick one, any one, but I’m sticking with health care for now, unless it profits from, or at the very least, does not experience a loss, or marginal growth as an artifact of said progress.
In some scenarios that is going to make sense. It can with energy, for example. But, with health care, it’s not going to make sense, and so it’s a fight.
What I find laughable is health care policy motivating voters being even debatable.
Where the fuck have you all been?June 15, 2018 at 2:22 pm #37502
Please name the important recent elections where a “Medicare for All” candidate won? Primaries where the Berniebot won in a deep red district and has zero chance of winning in the general don’t count.June 15, 2018 at 4:07 pm #37503
Yes they do.
Each campaign builds the movement, win or lose. Just like the last races. Most of those people are continuing to build on what they started.
Regarding red district races, those are extremely high value.
Remember, 1000 seats down leaves quite a few questionable GOP districts to play in.June 15, 2018 at 4:12 pm #37504
So again – can you name the winning candidates or not?June 15, 2018 at 4:22 pm #37505
Why would I bother?
Midterm races are playing out right now. You can see them same as me.
Working to compete with the money is not an easy thing. It’s a pretty damn heavy lift.
I’ll be happy if just one, or a few get elected to office.June 15, 2018 at 4:45 pm #37506
So you’ve basically confirmed my belief that “Medicare for All” is a losing issue for political candidates, which is why the Democratic Party hasn’t embraced it.June 15, 2018 at 4:45 pm #37507
NopeJune 15, 2018 at 4:50 pm #37508
By definition, if candidates who run on “Medicare for All” lose their elections, then it’s a losing issue – wishful thinking aside.June 15, 2018 at 7:15 pm #37509
Ah, nope.June 15, 2018 at 8:07 pm #37510VitalogyParticipant
Backing sure fire losing candidates is no way to advance your agenda.
And there is the problem with the Bernie Bots. If not 100% pure, they don’t show up or put forth protest votes that actually work against their “progressive” agenda.June 15, 2018 at 8:51 pm #37513
TL;DRJune 15, 2018 at 9:33 pm #37514VitalogyParticipant
Not sure what that means, but it proves your small minority viewpoint has zero attraction when it comes to elections.
By the way, how’s that Trump thing working out for you? It’s 1000% worse than what that evil bitch Hillary had planned for you Bernie Bots.
Let’s start with the SCOTUS and work down from there and document the damage that’s been done with the GOP trifecta, thanks to the Bernie Dildos that DIDN’T DO THE WORK WHEN IT COUNTED.
KSKD has no right to bitch about our current affairs as he helped lay the groundwork for what we have today.
Seriously, just vote GOP and be real in your effort to sabotage your goal. Have fun with that.June 15, 2018 at 10:40 pm #37517
Health care is a basic, human right.
Neither party appears willing and or able to lead on the issue.
The options are few: Either deal, or employ the political process.
I and many others are not going to deal.
The state of health care in the USA today is as unacceptable as denying same sex marriages was.
And we got that done too.
Now it’s time to get this done. It may be there is better than Medicare for All out there, possible. Great.
That debate is similar to whether civil unions was good enough. It wasn’t.
No American should fear not being able to see a doctor, or have to choose ugly things like divorce vs bankruptcy to get past crippling medical bills.
Tell you what. I’ll return the same concern you do.
Really worried about Trump and the GOP?
Concerned enough to get behind good health care policy?
And that’s where things are at, only add in some basics like living wages, college / student debt.
Real leadership is needed on these things. And if our current leaders can’t seem to give a shit economically, don’t expect the struggling majority of Americans to return that lack of concern with the kind of support expected.June 15, 2018 at 10:50 pm #37518
>KSKD has no right to bitch about our current affairs as he helped lay the groundwork for what we have today.
Sure I do. And I’ve actually gone and done the work to improve on that say too. Any of us can you know.
Now technically, you can go get Dan to vote me off the island. But that’s only germane to the discussion we are having here, and would be ultra petty. And I won’t mind if you somehow do. No worries.
Think it all the way through.
Notice we did go and vote F&B off the island a few times. Did that actually help?
>Let’s start with the SCOTUS and work down from there
How did it feel to watch our party roll over and let the GOP basically steal a SCOTUS pick. Regrettable, isn’t it? I think so.
How did that feel, given we ALL said, “It’s about the SCOTUS stupid?”
Let’s say I am less than impressed. That kind of “leadership” needs to go. We can do much better, and that starts by actually giving a shit about the majority of people being fucked over hard economically right now too.
Truth on all that is if Dems had not been limp dicks, Obama would have made one pick, Clinton probably would have won, and she would have made a second one.
And you want me to buy into the same garbage that got us here? LMAO!
You know F&B is gloating all that up. Bet your ass.
What about beating Dodger around like we did? A lot of tough smack got said, and now who is where?
That guy is holding down an elected office right now. Has quite a bit of say now, frankly. Got out there, took it to the people and won his election. And if he can do that, progressives can do that.
How does that feel? None too good from where I stand. And that’s because I really don’t believe in his politics. But, he did. Won too.
And losing 1000+ seats? Jesus.
Feels shitty. Like, “we need to do it differently” kind of shitty. Like maybe, just maybe, giving a shit about ordinary Americans makes more than a little sense, type shitty.
Other people are gonna give you the concern and consideration you give them. Fact.
Like I said, think it all the way through. I have.
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