List of Bull Shit, well debunked things.

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Viewing 11 posts - 1 through 11 (of 11 total)
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  • #3072
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    As we find ’em in discussion, let’s accumulate them into a list.

    First up: Objective Morality

    This is a concept or reasoning tool, highly idealized, but not actualized in any way I can find.

    Post to this thread when you’ve got something we’ve hashed over and over. Somebody wanting to get an item removed can start a thread with that purpose and let’s get after it.

    #3074
    jerry1949
    Spectator

    I thought it was self-evident that there is such a thing. Stuff like “thou shalt not murder” and “thou shalt not steal.”

    #3075
    duxrule
    Participant

    Whatever you say, Inspector Javert.

    #3076
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    If you want to get that one off the list, you need to present an argument. Start a thread and make your case.

    #3077
    Alfredo_T
    Participant

    How about ANY system of thought where the practitioners start out with some ideological position that they want to reach, and then they develop “scientific” arguments to support it?

    I am thinking of nice folks, such as:

    1) Creationism/”Intelligent Design” proponents (Ken Hamm, Ben Stein, et al)
    2) Climate change skeptics
    3) People who fear “modern” developments, such as vaccines

    #3082
    Andy Brown
    Participant

    That’s like drawing the curve and then plotting the data points. Utterly inept and typical right wing methodology.

    #3084
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    Totally agreed Alfredo.

    Got an idea to lable these things in some quick and easy to understand and discuss way?

    Generally, we can say irrational, but that is too broad. Not potent enough.

    @F&B, I have a thread running too. Bring your example and arguments. The point of this is to weed out useless basis, forcing us to either bring new ones out, thus improving all of us, or surrender positions that really have no rational basis, also improving us.

    Or, we can be honest and place it in the belief or preference box and understand what that means in terms of speaking with authority or implied authority on the related matters.

    An easy example is God Says. Nobody anywhere at all can offer anything other than a personal testament. That is fine to do, but not authoritative. Clearing out those things should focus discussion to a more productive end.

    You said this is your video game. Yeah, I get that, as do others.

    Time for us to level up some and give the new software some use worthy of Dan’s efforts.

    #3092
    Alfredo_T
    Participant

    “thou shalt not murder” and “thou shalt not steal.”

    I don’t want people to steal and I don’t want people to murder. Most people in society agree with these sentiments. However, the murderers generally don’t have a problem with murder and thieves generally don’t have a problem with stealing.

    On the subject of stealing, I recently watched Captain Phillips, which was a pretty good film. The Somalian pirates shown in the movie do not feel that what they are doing is wrong. The only issue that they have is that they are the ones doing the dirty work and putting their lives at risk. From their perspective, there is no other way; they need to please their crime bosses, and they need the money. From the perspective of the crime bosses, there is nothing wrong with coercing poor, starving men into looting merchant ships and even with killing the men if they don’t deliver.

    #3130
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    That was a good movie!

    And yes, that’s it exactly. As far as I can tell, any morality I’ve encountered has some dependencies on culture, one’s perspective, etc…

    So the question on the other thread is basically, “Can anyone show an example of morality where that’s not true?”

    That would start the discussion to validate the idea of there being objective morality. Right now, it’s a mere reasoning tool. Concept on par with the idea of Unicorns.

    Of course, like unicorns, having that idealized tool can be useful to reason with, but it’s not a valid basis otherwise.

    #3131
    duxrule
    Participant

    Les Mis? Shoot me. The best song in the movie comes 45 minutes in, then we have to listen to Jackman and Crowe croak and caterwaul for another two hours. It’s part of my life I’ll never get back. But I digress…I would also like someone to explain to me how these “morals” are exclusively Christian, when their chronicling took place thousands of years before anyone called a “Christian” even existed.

    #24846
    Andy Brown
    Participant

    Clearly we have some updates.

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