December 21, 2014 at 11:27 am #4748VitalogyParticipant
Here is where the climate change deniers should give things a try. Yes, pollution DOES have an impact.December 21, 2014 at 11:59 am #4751NotalentParticipant
Man made pollution is still less than natural pollution. One Volcanic eruption is much worse than all the crap man can spew into the air.
BTW do you know why so many in Beijing smoke cigarettes?
So they can get a breath of filtered air!December 21, 2014 at 12:30 pm #4753missing_kskdParticipant
Wait a minute…
Yes, a natural event can deliver more impact, but man made events are ongoing and the negative impacts are clear.
So why say that?
Is it to marginalize the idea of pollution overall? Why do that? Is it to marginalize the real costs?
Hmmm…December 21, 2014 at 3:03 pm #4754VitalogyParticipant
I guess Notalent is okay with pollution like that.
Not to mention, living on the West Coast, China’s pollution blows across the ocean and can have effects here too.
It’s ridiculous that an indoor facility has to be built so people can exist in clean air since it’s too hazardous to be outside.December 21, 2014 at 4:23 pm #4755paulwalkerParticipant
Yes! I was about to mention how this does indeed affect the west coast of the US.
Here is more:December 21, 2014 at 8:47 pm #4760AmusParticipant
Seems like a good time to reflect that that’s where we’ll be if the GOP gets their way.December 21, 2014 at 9:12 pm #4761missing_kskdParticipant
Just one data point on why we need to think about our environment.
The GOP really doesn’t want to own the idea of our environment being limited and finite.
For one, it gets in the way of the constant growth economy. Secondly, the idea of exploiting natural resources supports the growth economy, but it gets a lot more complicated when external costs get factored in.
ie: cost of oil compared to alternative energy and the value of investments related to both.
If we don’t accept environmental limits and we do not account for external costs in the overall viability, profitability of a business, oil is fantastic! It’s cheap, high energy density, and the investments are made. Drill baby drill!
With those things in place, suddenly the investments needed to build out new and additional energy infrastructure begin to make a lot of sense. Things like energy density are sub-par in most all cases, as is portability, but external costs are often lower, and where they are high, get amortized over the very long life span of things like solar cells.
There are consequences for our actions, and we’ve got one party who really doesn’t want to recognize those and we’ve got another one who does.
But, reality is the authority. Regardless of what the parties believe, or prefer ideologically, those consequences are going to manifest, as will the costs, and understanding that comes with a burden to manage it.
With the GOP, this can’t happen. Owning those realities means understanding some of the ideology isn’t practical, and they’ve got no alternative. Given the degree of polarization they have worked hard to achieve, walking it back some, or finding some common ground for progress means owning up to the costs and risks associated with their efforts.
Painful place for them, and all of us to be.December 22, 2014 at 1:09 am #4767skepticalParticipant
The worse thing about climate change deniers: poor people suffer.
The best thing about climate change deniers: they’ll suffer, too. Especially in their pocketbooks.
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