CONs embrace Solar

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  • #7510
    NoParty
    Participant

    Looks like some CONs are getting on the Solar Energy bandwagon. And even Religious Right thinks it just like what Jesus would do….

    WOW!!!!!!!!!!

    http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/why-more-conservatives-are-backing-solar-power/ar-BBi9EPN

    #7514
    jerry1949
    Spectator

    That’s fantastic. (As long as it pays it’s own way and there are no subsidies or tax incentives).

    #7516
    Amus
    Participant

    I’ve got solar.
    4.4K on the roof.

    Incentives and subsidies up the Ying Yang.

    Booyah!

    #7519
    shipwreck
    Participant

    Congratulations for Mr Goldwater in getting past his dislike for the messenger and paying attention to the message. Solar energy is a winner.

    #7529
    Alfredo_T
    Participant

    One of my reasons for no longer identifying with the Libertarian Party is my realization that real governments and societies do not operate by ideologically pure free market rules. One can shake one’s fist at the clouds, but short of businesses and industries being nationalized or goods being strictly rationed, this is how governments control economic behavior.

    Photovoltaic have been expensive since they were first developed in the 1950s. The Chinese government is heavily subsidizing the production of solar panels in hopes of running foreign competitors out of business. Governments in the US take a different approach, subsidizing the rollout of solar power systems, which would otherwise be too expensive to interest property owners.

    #7530
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    The need for purity has very seriously impacted our ability to respond and improve.

    Agreed Alfredo

    #7531
    jerry1949
    Spectator

    It’s not a question of “purity” that to be a viable and competetive form of energy, that it should stand on its own and not need taxpayers to foot a chunk of the bill. Those who don’t use solar power will have to use more of the convential forms of energy to earn the funds to transfer to the solar buyers.

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    “Solar energy remains prohibitively expensive – often three times more than electricity produced from natural gas and other sources,” according to a report by the Taxpayers Protection Alliance (TPA) entitled Filling the Solar Sinkhole: Billions of Bucks Have Delivered Too Little Bang.

    That includes the Ivanpah Solar Electric Generating System in California, the largest solar power plant of its type in the world, which generated only about half of the electricity it was expecting to produce last year due to “fewer sunny days” than initially predicted.

    “Despite reaping $1.6 billion in subsidies, [Ivanpah] produces electricity at a cost 3 times higher than traditional power and has requested $539 million in additional direct handouts from the federal government,” the report said.

    “We’re shining a bright spotlight on the darker side of solar power,” said TPA president David Williams. “Taxpayer-backed loans to the solar industry, bailouts, and publicly funded grants cost Americans more than $39 billion annually. Despite these massive costs, taxpayers aren’t even benefitting with lower electricity prices.”

    In addition to the federal tax credits, grants, guaranteed loans and other subsidies, “there are 43 different solar-power-related tax breaks available across 20 states” as well as “538 different state and local green energy rebate programs across the United States,” TPA researchers found.

    “These schemes are intended to reduce the final cost of products including solar water heaters and grid-connected rooftop solar panels to make them more appealing to customers.” However, even with generous government subsidies, including a tax credit that reduces the cost of installing solar panels by 30 percent, “none of it has worked,” the TPA report concluded.

    “With so little to show for so many costly initiatives, it should be apparent to objective observers that federal solar power efforts have not been a productive or prudent use of precious tax dollars.”

    http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/barbara-hollingsworth/despite-39b-annual-govt-subsidies-solar-produced-05-electricity

    #7535
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    Like I said, purity has impacted us in a negative way.

    A purist market view case in point.

    #7541
    jerry1949
    Spectator

    Here’s an article from the perspective that subsidies can be helpful in the beginning stage but must eventually be eliminated or else inefficeint companies are supported and the indurstry is hurt. It also comes from the perspective that solar energy is economical and can pay its own way.

    Government Subsidies: Silent Killer Of Renewable Energy

    Guest post written by Paul Nahi. Paul Nahi is CEO of Enphase Energy, a provider of micro-inverter systems for the solar industry.

    Hardly a day goes by that we don’t hear or engage in a conversation about energy. Too often, those conversations are about failed companies that lived only for government largesse. Whether the discussion is about the cost of energy, the damage being done to the environment, or national security issues, there is one constant: everyone agrees that the world needs safe, clean, and affordable energy…

    entire article: http://www.forbes.com/sites/ciocentral/2013/02/14/government-subsidies-silent-killer-of-renewable-energy/

    #7542
    duxrule
    Participant

    I agree that most, if not all subsidies should be phased out over time.

    #7638
    NoParty
    Participant

    Government Subsidies: Silent Killer Of Renewable Energy

    But without them in the beginning Solar would still be stuck in the 1990’s.

    #7651
    Vitalogy
    Participant

    How much subsidy has oil received over the years?

    #7657
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    …and is still getting.

    When we stop those, I’ll hear “no subsidy” arguments much better.

    Apple, BTW, is investing in a very large solar plant for it’s longer term power needs.

    #7658
    Broadway
    Participant

    I’ve been a solar fan ever since I’ve heard of the technology as a kid. Just seems natural and ultra clean.
    The only real need now is vast improvement of the collection device. My dream is a vehicle that every part of the surface/car body is a solar collector…even the windshield.

    #7665
    duxrule
    Participant

    Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t storage one of the main issues, rather than transmission? I recently saw a piece on large-scale storage, which would help eliminate one of the big bugaboos about solar and wind.

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