Bernie drops out

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 73 total)
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  • #45639
    Brianl
    Participant

    … now it’s time for the Democrats to unify behind Biden.

    Failure to do so gives us four more years of Trump.

    #45640
    paulwalker
    Participant

    Probably doesn’t change much. 25 percent of his supporters will reluctantly vote for Biden, 25 percent will vote for Trump, 50 percent won’t vote.

    #45642
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    I will not be casting a vote for Biden. The DNC could select someone that makes sense. Let us hope they do.

    #45643
    Brianl
    Participant

    I understand your angst Doug, but a vote for anyone but Biden is a vote for Trump.

    I don’t like that thought either, but what I hate more is the thought of four more years of Trump. I honestly don’t know if we can ever recover from that.

    #45645
    semoochie
    Participant

    There is a middle scenario: If Trump is re-elected but the democrats continue to control the House and regain the Senate, they can impeach him again and immediately vote for his removal from office. He could be gone by spring!

    #45646
    Brianl
    Participant

    Semoochie – sure, if there’s 67 Democratic senators. I can’t see any Republicans (other than Mitt Romney) breaking ranks.

    #45647
    lastday
    Participant

    If Biden is the candidate, and you won’t vote for him, you’ve voted for Trump. Simple.

    #45648
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    You are asking me to vote for one feeble liar toxic to women minorities and labor because we don’t like the other liar toxic to women minorities in labor.

    They either pick someone that makes sense, or it’s not going to happen. They have options, they can use them. I hope they do.

    And no matter how much you say it, the only votes for Trump are votes for Trump. You’ve got 40% plus of the nation they’re going to sit it out no confidence.

    That’s Biden’s problem, that’s the DNC problem. It’s not mine.

    Shiting on people for a long time calling him every name in the book then asking them for votes isn’t very good strategy. I don’t support people that shit on me, neither should you.

    #45649
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    I’m off mobile.

    Fact is, way too many people aren’t going to go for Biden. He’s going to lose to Trump hard, same way Clinton did.

    And he’s not the nominee yet.

    Whoever they do pick is going to have to make an appeal to a lot of people.

    If that appeal contains one, maybe two major issue positions that are credible, and aligned with current, and growing more ugly realities?

    That person has a shot, could win, I would support them.

    #45650
    Andrew
    Participant

    SEMOOCHIE:

    There is a middle scenario: If Trump is re-elected but the democrats continue to control the House and regain the Senate, they can impeach him again and immediately vote for his removal from office. He could be gone by spring!

    So you think the Democrats will be able to impeach AND remove a president who has just been popularly re-elected? (Let’s assume he won legitimately – maybe he loses the popular vote again but wins in the electoral college.) Such a blatant move to overturn the will of the voters in a recent election is going to go nowhere – not even in the House.

    #45651
    Andrew
    Participant

    Missing, did you get your Trump 2020 bumper sticker yet?

    #45652
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    Blame the people insisting on Biden. Those people gave Biden a ton of media, have shit on Bernie and supporters non stop.

    So, now what?

    Maybe they should have thought that part all the way through.

    I could vote for Biden and do my best for him, and he will lose just like Clinton did.

    What part of VOTE FOR do people not understand?

    The hard fact is this is just not a zero sum game.

    40 plus percent of people already are no confidence. they stay home, same as they did for Clinton.

    Bernie can’t drag them in any better than he did for Clinton. And he’s gonna try, and he has my money to try with too. No worries.

    If it were not for Bernie, Dem excitement would be even less overall. He brings those people into the process. He can do that, as can his advocates, because the policy ideas make sense. They are an answer to the basic question, “Why bother”, and or “What is in it for me?”

    Biden lacks answers to both.

    Why?

    Before Trump: More Americans struggle every year

    With Trump: Even more Americans struggle every year

    Biden: Remember how it was before Trump?

    Bernie: Let’s end the struggle together.

    Simple as that, and I am being charitable basically leaving his decline out of the core point.

    Edit: Who are the largest donor bloc behind Bernie? Teachers. Go research Bidens role in their unions, schools and his likely cabinet picks and tell me what they get excited about.

    Sure Trump is even worse! But, Trumps people live him! Biden has a smallish bloc feel that way, with the rest holding their nose, if they bother. To most of them, it is basically voting for a nicer Republican rather than the not so nice Republucan. Numbers won’t be there.

    Fact is the well heeled bloc in the party hates Bernie’s policy, and they have financial and ideological reasons. Media is aligned as are the big donors.

    Totally get it. And they get to do all that, it is legal, the whole nine. But, people get to turn their backs too.

    Those well heeled people, along with scared older voters watching cable news, are 12, give or take a point or two, percent of all voters.

    The win happens in the GE, and that consists of way more not so well heeled people, who just don’t see the point. People who are not Dems, who number 2x the entire party no less!

    Not all of them are turning their backs, just enough to be a real problem I have discussed twice in a row now.

    This is a problem that does not just go away Andrew.

    Biden does not have it. No excitement, makes no attempt to generate it, makes no attempt to even understand. A very large majority of that 12 percent doesn’t bother either.

    Biden has a turnout problem. It is bigger than Clinton’s was too. I did not think that was possible, but it is.

    So help a guy out, what answers do we give to those people asking those questions?

    I don’t have any, and can scream “But Trump….” until the end of time too. That is not an answer, and it does not GOTV because it is not an answer.

    The kids get it.

    They have proposed an effort to boost turnout, and they have come to Biden for commits to positive answers so they actually can go to those people with SOMETHING.

    So far from Biden?

    Crickets, and a very recent rejection on Medicare for All during a historic pandemic where tons of people are losing their health care.

    I am very concerned. Trump again is totally on the table firm.

    I just do not know what it actually takes for that establishment bloc in the party to be reasonable humans and recognize way too many people really do n33d policy consideration.

    Without it? We are gonna get Trump.

    You tell me what I go tell em. I have no fucking clue.

    Maybe we can talk about the shitty treatment I got both times before I talk about a vote.

    See how that works?

    I did say it was an object lesson. Go think about it.

    #45653
    lastday
    Participant

    This has probably been discussed in another thread and I missed it. (Edit: Or maybe it’s addressed in the previous post and I just can’t process all the words right now)

    What do Sanders supporters do if he endorses Biden? Will they still refuse to support Biden? That seems like a tacit admission that they don’t trust their own guy after all.

    #45654
    missing_kskd
    Participant

    Bernie doesn’t control anyone. Bernie can attract support and has.

    There are reasons for that support.

    The important reasons do not apply to Biden.

    Bernie can say what he wants, but it is up to Biden to attract that support, or it just goes away, just like it did last time.

    So what happens is people expect Biden to garner that support.

    Currently Biden is hiding. Won’t go well. Same as it did for Clinton, who also hid rather than attempt to garner that support.

    You are correct. Bernie endorsement of Biden is for contractual reasons, and because Bernie is friends with Biden.

    Neither of these things are compelling reasons to support Biden, given Biden pretty much is not for the great ideas Bernie is, and has a very different voting record than Bernie has.

    I think the DNC should just exercise it’s right to select a nominee and pick someone that stands a chance against Trump, rather than lose hard with Biden.

    #45655
    Andrew
    Participant

    Clearly, what matters to the Bernie Bros is their little cult electing one of their own – not about Americans who are suffering under Trump. It’s not even about Sanders – he begged his supporters to vote for Clinton after he endorsed her in 2016, but many didn’t listen.

    It doesn’t matter to them if Trump appoints two more right-winger Supreme Court justices in 2021 – what matters to them is their anti-establishment cult succeeding. The policy stuff they claim to care about is just for show – because if they really cared about it, they’d be all-for Biden or any Democrat defeating Trump. Anyone with an ounce of common sense knows having any Democrat in office advances their alleged agenda at least a little vs setting it way back with more 30+ year Supreme Court appointments blocking most of what they claim to want to change.

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