feedback.pdxradio.com » Politics and other things

  1. Vitalogy

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,986

    "I'll vote for principle over self-interest every time."

    Of course you do. That's how the puppet masters like it.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 10:13 AM #
  2. missing_kskd

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 14,523

    Exactly. Text book authoritarian.

    I wonder why he can't say anything other than condoms. Is he afraid to talk about girl parts and stuff? I'm serious!

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 10:35 AM #
  3. Nope, I'm just not looking for freebies, handouts, and special deals at someone else's expense, in the name of "entitlement."

    Substitute "bc pills" or whatever else you like for the "c word." Just making a point. Not giving you whatever bc you want is not forcing my beliefs on you.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 10:55 AM #
  4. duxrule

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 4,618

    Electing to not provide insurance coverage, based on religious tenets, most certainly is.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 11:00 AM #
  5. Vitalogy

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,986

    "Nope, I'm just not looking for freebies, handouts, and special deals at someone else's expense, in the name of "entitlement."

    Yet your perverted cult of a church certainly enjoys it's freebies, handouts, and special deals at someone else's expense in the name of tax free status, courtesy of us non-brainwashed tax payers.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 12:00 PM #
  6. edust1958

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 1,484

    Keep pushing this line of reasoning and you'll win converts to treating churches like EVERY OTHER BUSINESS... you can pay your property taxes on your edifices, schools, etc. The more you beat this drum, the happier I am about being able to disavow any connection to the Roman Catholic Church -- happy home of the pedophile priests!

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 01:40 PM #
  7. Andy_brown

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,261

    "Not giving you whatever bc you want is not forcing my beliefs on you."

    No special rights for Catholics.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 03:28 PM #
  8. "Electing to not provide insurance coverage, based on religious tenets, most certainly is."

    We're going in circles now.

    BC isn't "insurance coverage" and is no big deal to anyone who is working to buy it themselves. It IS a big deal to those who want to bring down the religious institutions, though.

    “Why does a governmental administrative decision now mean the end of institutions that have been built up over several generations from small donations, often from immigrants, and through the services of religious women and men and others who wanted to be part of the church’s mission in healing and education? Catholic hospitals, universities and social services have an institutional conscience, a conscience shaped by Catholic moral and social teaching. The HHS regulations now before our society will make it impossible for Catholic institutions to follow their conscience.”

    http://www.calwatchdog.com/2012/03/09/gov-brown-assaults-religious-liberty/

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 03:40 PM #
  9. "Keep pushing this line of reasoning and you'll win converts to treating churches like EVERY OTHER BUSINESS... you can pay your property taxes on your edifices, schools, etc. The more you beat this drum, the happier I am about being able to disavow any connection to the Roman Catholic Church -- happy home of the pedophile priests!"

    The Church is more of a home to very good and decent men and women, some of the saintly, who do much good in the world, edust. And your anti-Catholic bigotry is rearing its ugly head.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 03:44 PM #
  10. Andy_brown

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,261

    "And your anti-Catholic bigotry is rearing its ugly head."

    That's a laugh, coming from the biggest racist on this board.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 03:48 PM #
  11. edust1958

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 1,484

    Fairandbalanced... "The Church is more of a home to very good and decent men and women, some of the saintly, who do much good in the world, edust."

    I would agree that in many churches there are many good men and women... some of them Buddhist, Hindu, Mormon, etc.... I would argue that most would be good regardless of their particular beliefs ... and some are good IN SPITE of what their religious teachers proclaim...

    "And your anti-Catholic bigotry is rearing its ugly head."

    If you really knew me, you would know how wrong your statement is... I was giving you a friendly warning that pushing relentlessly on a "non-issue" is giving your faith a really bad name... and it's public image is already on life support!

    I find it more discriminatory that Roman Catholics tend to capitalize the word "church" when applied to the Roman Catholic church as if they had a monopoly on truth...

    I believe that when we finally get to meet God face-to-face that He will disabuse us of all of the stupid stuff that we attached to his message to love one another as we love ourselves... all of the hate because some people were created by God to love people of the same sex... that some people were created with a healthy sex drive and a deep capacity to gain meaningful joy from physical love with their partner(s). All of us... not just those who subscribe to some man-made set of silly rules invented to keep the guilt-based payments rolling in to sustain the hierarchy...

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 04:00 PM #
  12. Obviously God wants this to happen. Otherwise, you know, he could step in since it such an important matter. Keep praying, I guess.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 04:44 PM #
  13. missing_kskd

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 14,523

    LOL!!

    ...or pounding drums.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 04:54 PM #
  14. Sure. You could do that. You may accidentally make it snow though and...hey wait a minute...

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 05:01 PM #
  15. Mrs.Merkin

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 1,432

    "I find it more discriminatory that Roman Catholics tend to capitalize the word "church" when applied to the Roman Catholic church as if they had a monopoly on truth..."

    (Most of) The newspapers in Utah do the same thing, but it's for the Mormons

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 05:14 PM #
  16. "If you really knew me, you would know how wrong your statement is... I was giving you a friendly warning that pushing relentlessly on a "non-issue" is giving your faith a really bad name... and it's public image is already on life support!"

    Your slam against all Catholics because of pedophile priests was not "friendly," and forcing religious institutions to provide contraception is by far not a "non-issue."

    "I find it more discriminatory that Roman Catholics tend to capitalize the word "church" when applied to the Roman Catholic church as if they had a monopoly on truth..."

    That's not the reason it's capitalized. It's just a form of shorthand.

    "I believe that when we finally get to meet God face-to-face that He will disabuse us of all of the stupid stuff that we attached to his message to love one another as we love ourselves... all of the hate because some people were created by God to love people of the same sex... "

    It's not "hate" to speak the truth about disordered behavior. God created us to love one another, but we are a fallen race and are confused about the difference between lust and love.

    "All of us... not just those who subscribe to some man-made set of silly rules invented to keep the guilt-based payments rolling in to sustain the hierarchy..."

    You couldn't hack the disciplines imposed by the Church--fine you went your own way and now have your own beliefs. Those who remain don't believe the rules are "silly" or "man-made." And just because you do, it doesn't give you the right to push your contraceptives on Church-based institutions. I have never made a "guilt-based" contribution to the Church, and have never seen "guilt-based" appeals.

    It's sad that you look only at what you perceive to be the "negative" while entirely missing beauty of the Church and the Sacraments, and the peace it brings to the soul.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 05:52 PM #
  17. NoParty

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 11,617

    Those who remain don't believe the rules are "silly" or "man-made."

    Where is there reference to to confessing to a MORTAL man in the Bible?

    Where does it say that you should pray to Mother Mary?

    Where does it say in the Bible that Priests can drink and smoke?

    Where does it say that speaking in tongues is the right thing to do....?

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 06:03 PM #
  18. missing_kskd

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 14,523

    Remember kids, "I BELIEVE" goes in front of all of that. No authority at all, unless YOU PERSONALLY grant said authority and submit.

    Would you seriously submit to that? Would you do it after getting a long hard look at the kind of people produced?

    Sheesh!

    F&B, people take a holistic view of things. So, we are back to the bag of sugar and shit.

    What you are asking people to do is look at this bag of shit, with a little sugar mixed in. "COME ON PEOPLE, LOOK AT THAT FUCKING SUGAR!", when the truth is, they are afraid to even open up the bag for it REEKS OF SHIT, JESUS! CAN YOU SMELL THAT LOAD OF SHIT, AND WHO IS THIS CLOWN TRYING TO PUT THE BAG OVER ON ME ANYWAY?

    Yeah, it's like that, and there is the harm you've done right there. I know people who have read this thread, swearing off anything even remotely associated with Roman Catholics, and you can count me among them.

    We don't need you guys at all. Really.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 06:04 PM #
  19. Vitalogy

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,986

    F&B, I think you're the one who has "disordered behavior". I don't think there's any poster here that would disagree with me.

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 07:16 PM #
  20. NoParty

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 11,617

    Those who remain don't believe the rules are "silly" or "man-made."

    Where is there reference to to confessing to a MORTAL man in the Bible?

    Where does it say that you should pray to Mother Mary?

    Where does it say in the Bible that Priests can drink and smoke?

    Where does it say that speaking in tongues is the right thing to do....?

    UF&UB?????

    Posted on March 21, 2012 - 07:22 PM #
  21. duxrule

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 4,618

    "BC isn't "insurance coverage" and is no big deal to anyone who is working to buy it themselves. It IS a big deal to those who want to bring down the religious institutions, though."

    Pregnancy isn't a "disease," but BC is preventive medicine, and insurance companies have a vested interest in providing such coverage to help keep their costs down. Ask any doctor or health care provider. Carrying a child to term is one of the most stressful, most difficult and most dangerous things that a woman can do to her body. Helping women have control of that process for WHEN THEY'RE READY to take on that challenge saves everyone money. You keep claiming that BC is "inexpensive," so it doesn't need to be included in insurance coverage. That's part of the reason for your fixation on condoms (but only PART, I'm certain), because condoms ARE relatively inexpensive. However, I'd like to see some other hard data that supports your claim.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 10:26 AM #
  22. "We don't need you guys at all. Really."

    This says it all.

    We don't need your charities, hospitals, and schools.

    That's the job of THE STATE and government union workers.

    Big Brother knows what's best.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 11:04 AM #
  23. edust1958

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 1,484

    "BC isn't "insurance coverage" and is no big deal to anyone who is working to buy it themselves."

    So because you claim that birth control is inexpensive, it shouldn't be covered through insurance... band aids aren't expensive either... so we should make everyone pay immediately for the band aids and other consumables that they need while receiving medical treatment...

    There is no basis for your argument other than your own religious choice and if we honor your religious choice, we need to honor ALL possible choices that can be made based on claims of religious freedom... including some that you and I would agree are reprehensible...

    "We don't need your charities, hospitals, and schools.
    That's the job of THE STATE and government union workers.
    Big Brother knows what's best."

    Versus Big Religion right? I'm sure you'd love living under Sharia Law...

    I have worked for government (not union) and it is not as monolithic as the concept of "Big Brother" suggests... I worry more about Google who has a greater ability to assemble data and pry into our private lives for financial gain...

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 11:29 AM #
  24. One can choose to work or not work at a Catholic institution. One can choose to use or not use their services. Nothing is being forced on anyone as is the case of Sharia Law or Obama tyranny.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 11:45 AM #
  25. Andy_brown

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,261

    "Nothing is being forced on anyone"

    Except if you make that choice, you are being forced to accept lesser benefits.

    No special rights for Catholics.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 11:50 AM #
  26. Skybill9

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 9,698

    I don't have a problem with them covering BC pills on insurance. They should be just like any other covered medication, where you pay a co-pay.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 12:31 PM #
  27. BC isn't "medication" except under special circumstances and it is not withheld for those reasons.

    You don't have "a problem" with it because you don't think birth control is immoral. These institutions for centuries have not been forced to go against their consciences and pass out condoms, birth control pills, and provide sterilization to their employees and students.

    They now have no choice but to fight in the courts and hope for a victory there, refuse and suffer the consequences, or go out of business and stop doing their good deeds. I believe that they know full well what they are doing and that they are purposely undermining the religious organizations, hoping (vainly) to force a doctrinal change, or force them to shut down.

    Nobody is forced to work for a Catholic institution or attend a Catholic school, and if they are worthy of being an employer or a teacher, it is worth the tiny "sacrifice" of not getting "free" bc.

    And mark my words, these bastards are chomping at the bit in anticipation of the ultimate victory of forcing religious organizations to provide free abortions.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 01:06 PM #
  28. Andy_brown

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,261

    "And mark my words, these bastards are chomping at the bit in anticipation of the ultimate victory of forcing religious organizations to provide free abortions."

    First, absolutely no one on planet Earth is going to mark your words. Label them as stupid, irrelevant and a waste of ocular time would more likely be the case.

    As far as forcing religious organizations to do anything that is not a legal requirement, you can rest your distorted brain over. But when it's the law of the land, it's the law for everybody.

    No special rights for Catholics.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 01:30 PM #
  29. Mrs.Merkin

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 1,432

    "First, absolutely no one on planet Earth is going to mark your words. Label them as stupid, irrelevant and a waste of ocular time would more likely be the case."

    Exactly!

    My laugh of the day! Thanks!

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 01:53 PM #
  30. Amus

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 3,294

    Good Grief!!
    What a dilusional Loon!

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 02:38 PM #
  31. Notalent

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 2,392

    "You don't have "a problem" with it because you don't think birth control is immoral"

    It's not the birth control that is immoral, it's the members of your congregation fornicating before marriage and then asking forgiveness that is actually immoral in your papal eyes.

    Birth control is actually only the symptom of a greater immorality if you were to be true to your doctrin.

    Once you can all be perfect and not be fornicating when you don't actually want a baby, or are not married, THEN you won't need birth control no matter who pays for it.

    Simple.

    Until then sinners should and do have access to the prevention of the result of their own immorality.

    Meanwhile the rest of us non-doctrinarians will continue to practice self responsiblity or else pay for the consequences or our choices or the prevention thereof.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 02:59 PM #
  32. Anyone who wants birth control can get it easily and and a small cost, notalent. They don't need Catholics to give it to them and Catholics should not be forced to do so, regardless of whoever is sinning.

    This new law is unjust.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 03:04 PM #
  33. duxrule

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 4,618

    "These institutions for centuries have not been forced to go against their consciences and pass out condoms, birth control pills, and provide sterilization to their employees and students."

    No, instead, they've turned a blind eye to basic human nature, making it a "sin." Refusing to acknowledge that people are going to have sex, to the point where clergy is barred from participating, and church members that do are "doomed to perdition" ISN'T an enlightened moral position. The real truth is that "for centuries," the Catholic church has tried to criminalize sex, all the while practicing it lustily behind closed doors. The church has a LONG way to go before they have any kind of "enlightened" stand on sexual relations.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 03:42 PM #
  34. missing_kskd

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 14,523

    Waaaaaambulance please!

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 03:49 PM #
  35. Broadway

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 2,551

    >>people are going to have sex
    God's plan is to have sex within marriage alone...any other brings problems/sin as we can see much in daily news. To me the "jury's out" on the topic of birth control (Hebrews 13:4 "Honor marriage, and guard the sacredness of sexual intimacy between wife and husband. God draws a firm line against casual and illicit sex.") although I totally oppose the taxpayer paying for it.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 04:14 PM #
  36. "No, instead, they've turned a blind eye to basic human nature, making it a "sin." Refusing to acknowledge that people are going to have sex, to the point where clergy is barred from participating, and church members that do are "doomed to perdition" ISN'T an enlightened moral position. The real truth is that "for centuries," the Catholic church has tried to criminalize sex, all the while practicing it lustily behind closed doors. The church has a LONG way to go before they have any kind of "enlightened" stand on sexual relations."

    I understand you aren't a Catholic and don't agree with their doctrine. But Catholics do, regardless of whether they are sinners or saints.

    There are many of the faith who take it seriously and do strive to live good holy lives, and some who don't do so well, but at least know they are doing wrong and have a great respect for the Church, and judging them by the bad apples would be like calling all Muslims terrorists.

    Your issues with Catholics and Catholicism are irrelevant regarding whether the law is just, but very relevant and enlightening regarding the sinister motivation behind it.

    You can't see the injustice of forcing a school to give birth control to students it teaches that birth control is immoral because you don't want them teaching anything like that, and this is a way to take them out.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 04:36 PM #
  37. duxrule

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 4,618

    "You can't see the injustice of forcing a school to give birth control to students it teaches that birth control is immoral because you don't want them teaching anything like that, and this is a way to take them out."

    You fail to recognize that you're adhering to an archaic and antiquated belief system. And before you get all butthurt about that, yes, I realize that there are millions of others who supposedly keep those same beliefs. It doesn't make them any less archaic and antiquated.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 04:42 PM #
  38. Andy_brown

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,261

    "There are many of the faith who take it seriously"

    How the fuck would you know? Quit speaking for a church that you hold no position of power nor influence in.
    You are merely a worshiper. Your incessant use of the second person is fraudulent.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 04:59 PM #
  39. Vitalogy

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,986

    So let me get this straight:

    If you are catholic, you can't have sex until you're married. Once married, you can have sex but can't use birth control of any kind. And if you get pregnant, you must give birth no matter what.

    So what do you do if you want to have sex with your wife but don't want children? Spray and pray? Or have no sex after you are done wanting children.

    No wonder this cult of church has such a sex problem. Their stupid little rules drive humans mad to the point of comitting sex crimes against little boys.

    I can understand the no sex until marriage, which I personally think is stupid. But the stand against birth control is asinine.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:26 PM #
  40. Brianl

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 5,125

    "I understand you aren't a Catholic and don't agree with their doctrine. But Catholics do, regardless of whether they are sinners or saints."

    So explain why 90% of Catholic women are in favor of contraception then.

    Liar.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:28 PM #
  41. missing_kskd

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 14,523

    Blah, blah, blah...

    Again: People are going to have sex. They are going to do it when they want to do it, except for the dumb ones who get sucked into a bunch of fairy tale garbage that will likely do them mental harm over the course of their lives.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:39 PM #
  42. Andy_brown

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,261

    "Only the wisest and the stupidest of men never change.

    ~Confucius

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:43 PM #
  43. I don't believe that 90% of Catholic women are in favor of contraception and have never seen any proof that they are. Note that it would be unfair to include CINOs--but just those who actually practice or make a good attempt to practice the faith, such as doing the minimal of going to church every week. Someone who just shows up at mass for a funeral for her mother is not "practicing" the faith.

    And even if that were true, it has zero effect on the doctrine, since we don't get to vote to have our favorite sins excluded. If 90% of Catholic women "favor" birth control, then 90% of Catholic women need to decide whether they should be Catholics or not. But I don't trust this figure, and so far I have only heard something about 90% from "the traitor" who thank God no longer is is the speaker of the house.

    "No wonder this cult of church has such a sex problem. Their stupid little rules drive humans mad to the point of comitting sex crimes against little boys."

    Then how do you explain all the sex crimes done by family members, school teachers, scout leaders, etc., who don't have the same rules imposed upon them?

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:44 PM #
  44. Andy_brown

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,261

    "I don't believe that 90% of Catholic women are in favor of contraception"

    Speak of the stupidest man in the world, and he will appear.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:47 PM #
  45. "Again: People are going to have sex. They are going to do it when they want to do it, except for the dumb ones who get sucked into a bunch of fairy tale garbage that will likely do them mental harm over the course of their lives."

    They're going to get drunk and overeat too. What's the point?

    Because you and Obama think that Catholic doctrine is "fairy tales" you can destroy their organizations?

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:47 PM #
  46. Andy_brown

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,261

    Catholic doctrine and the Catholic Church would be well advised to pay attention to the words of James T. Kirk:

    "Conquest is easy. Control is not."

    You don't speak for the Church or Catholics, anyway. Quit trying.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:49 PM #
  47. Vitalogy

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 6,986

    Was birth control available back when "doctrine" (gibberish bullshit) was written?

    Responsible, moral adults use birth control in order to reduce the chance of having to consider abortion if an unwanted pregnancy should occur.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 05:51 PM #
  48. Interesting side-note about the benefits to "big pharma":

    "Forget for a minute the religious question and look at who wins big here: Big Pharma. This mandate is not really about condoms or generic versions of “the pill,” which are available free or cheap in lots of places. This is about brand-name birth control drugs and other devices that some consumers swear off because they are too expensive. The Health and Human Services (HHS) mandate requires health-insurance companies provide contraceptive coverage for all “FDA approved contraceptive methods.” It does not insist on generics. And it does not offer any cost containment.

    What’s more, the mandate prevents health-insurance companies from having copays or deductibles for the benefit. This is the perfect set up for Big Pharma. Since the drugs will be paid for by a third party (insurance companies, who will pass the cost on to employers and the rest of us), the consumer won’t worry about the price. Expensive brand names will no doubt see demand rise. Ask more health-care analysts why the cost of medical services continues to rise so rapidly and near the top of the list is the fact that a third-party payment system won’t contain costs.

    Back in 2009, many observers were surprised when Big Pharma came out in favor of President Obama’s health-care reform bill. The industry spent millions running television ads in favor of the law and industry lobbyists pushed hard for it. One important reason they did so was the promise that with the new law they would have a new market of millions of new customers. The contraceptive mandate is a perfect example.

    http://hotair.com/archives/2012/03/02/pelosi-because-90-of-catholic-women-use-contraception-we-have-to-mandate-that-catholic-orgs-buy-it/ "

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 06:01 PM #
  49. Brianl

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 5,125

    "I don't believe that 90% of Catholic women are in favor of contraception and have never seen any proof that they are."

    The onus is on YOU to prove us otherwise, slappy. We're done playing your stupid, fucking ridiculous game.

    "Note that it would be unfair to include CINOs--but just those who actually practice or make a good attempt to practice the faith, such as doing the minimal of going to church every week. Someone who just shows up at mass for a funeral for her mother is not "practicing" the faith."

    Nice to see that you dictate Catholic doctrine, Pope. Do the world a favor and go hug a land mine.

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 06:26 PM #
  50. duxrule

    vacuum tube
    Posts: 4,618

    Actually, the Guttmacher Institute says that the number is actually closer to 98%:

    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/feb/06/cecilia-munoz/white-house-official-says-98-catholic-women-have-u/

    Posted on March 22, 2012 - 06:31 PM #

RSS feed for this topic

Reply »

You must log in to post.